[vipmk]

Hi everyone,

New to this site - from Ottawa, Canada and owners of a new 2023 Outlander PHEV. First of all, we love virtually everything about the vehicle, but there is one major thing that sucks. We took delivery in late November, so it wasn't too cold as of yet, but now that we are in February (even January for that matter), I've decided the heater system is one of the worst that I've encountered (I've owned a dozen or so vehicles to compare with). To be specific, when the heater system works well, it works well. The problem, is getting heat out of the vents early on, as you can with an ICE once it warms up for 5 minutes. When the vehicle is cold, but running for 10 - 15 minutes, which is far too long to wait when it's -30C outside, it puts out good heat. To be clear, I understand there is a combination rad/heat pump system and that to get the most out of it, all economy/EV aspects have to be turned off (& recirc turned on at the early stage to minimize outside cold air from entering, but you can only leave that on for a bit before condensation starts being problematic). If the car has a chance to warm up in our garage (using the app), it's nice and warm in the cabin after 15 minutes, but if you drive off and park in a grocery store parking lot for 10-15 minutes, coming back out to the PHEV and turning on the full blower system, it still takes 5 - 7 minutes to generate any useful heat. One would think, as with a traditional ICE vehicle, that the Radiator portion would still be warm enough to have heat come off the core into the cabin, but not so with this PHEV. I spoke to Mitsu Cda and they said call the dealer (who is still on a learning curve IMO). In any event, I spoke with the dealer today, asking the Service manager if he could reach out to Mitsu Cda, who could then ask Mistu HQ if something could be electronically tweaked. I was told, he could only inquire if I first brought the vehicle in and left it for two days (wtf), so they could test it. As we only have the one vehicle, that's not really an option, so we'll continue to rely heavily on the seat heaters. If anyone else, in a really cold part of North America, could provide any insight on this, it would be much appreciated - perhaps there is a legitimate hack or DIY tweak that could improve it? Again, virtually everything else about the Outlander PHEV, we love and are optimistic, the A/C, which I would think is traditional in it's implementation, should work okay in the high temperatures of an Ottawa summer (35C). Cheers.

 

[Hasenphever]

I'm in Ottawa as well, I've noticed the heat takes a bit longer compared to my previous 2009 Outlander but it's not too bad. I got a pair of light-weight touch friendly gloves as my winter "driving gloves" and keep my jacket zipped up more for short trips. But none in our family are annoyed by the slower heater. I have a teenager that doesn't even believe in wearing a jacket!

I'm actually more concerned with the drive battery being too cold to drive. After plugging in overnight and pre-heating for 10 minutes I did not get the performance reduction b/c too cold warning when it was -17C. I don't want to hijack this thread though so I am also interested in hearing others experiences with how long the heater takes to getting to the set temp.

 

[vipmk]

One more thing - the manual, in chapter 6, speaks about limited heater performance in "low" temperatures. Of course, not even the dealer seems to know what "low" temperature means LOL.

I'm in Ottawa as well, I've noticed the heat takes a bit longer compared to my previous 2009 Outlander but it's not too bad. I got a pair of light-weight touch friendly gloves as my winter "driving gloves" and keep my jacket zipped up more for short trips. But none in our family are annoyed by the slower heater. I have a teenager that doesn't even believe in wearing a jacket!

I'm actually more concerned with the drive battery being too cold to drive. After plugging in overnight and pre-heating for 10 minutes I did not get the performance reduction b/c too cold warning when it was -17C. I don't want to hijack this thread though so I am also interested in hearing others experiences with how long the heater takes to getting to the set temp.

Hey, fellow Ottawan. As an update, we left the Rideau Center underground parking lot yesterday after 90 minutes (so the car was relatively warm) and it still took 11 minutes (I'm logging such events now) for the heater to finally start blowing out some warm air while we were on the QW. This is problematic, as the defroster was needed to get rid of condensation caused by four passengers and of course, it's blowing out freezing cold air in the process. I hear what you're saying about dressing warm, but really now, this is a 2023 car that should have been better designed for colder climates. BTW, I'd be completely okay with giving up battery efficiency, in order to get some heat in the car in a timely fashion. We're really hoping the vehicle runs well over it's lifetime, because it's not a fun time to deal with the dealer (we had a previous Mitusbishi also). Ps if enough people complain to Mitsubishi Cda about this, their engineers in Japan will address it, otherwise, keep your long johns and driving gloves available LOL. Cheers.

 

[Hasenphever]

Yeah I can see 11 minutes being really long especially with condensation. What were your control settings? In the winter I make sure the Auto and A/C buttons are pressed at set my side for 19C, and tbh it has not seemed to take 11 minutes for me. Anyways, I will try to pay more attention and will report back.

 

[slick]

if its really cold i just put it on battery save for the first few minuets of driving then set to normal with defog and floor set on witch is where i have been leaving it as of late . no issues .

 

[vipmk]

if its really cold i just put it on battery save for the first few minuets of driving then set to normal with defog and floor set on witch is where i have been leaving it as of late . no issues .

Thanks for the reply - can you tell me what "really cold" means, i.e., anything below freezing? Unfortunately, their manual is very vague and only references "low temperatures" with no numbers provided. I'm guessing you're thoughts are that you'll be forcing the engine to run and thus make benefit from the radiator - I'll give this a try, but I think the problem is that the "heat pump" is used regardless and it doesn't seem to be efficient at providing early heat, e.g., not until after 5 - 7 minutes of the vehicle running even though it might have only been parked in the grocery store parking lot for 10 minutes. Cheers.

 

[Hasenphever]

This is a bit of a pain but you could also pre-heat via the app 10 minutes before you are done in the grocery store.

 

[vipmk]

Agreed - that's what we've been doing, when possible. It's more the aspect that when we head out anywhere, say to the grocery store and then, when leaving the grocery store after 10 minutes or so, trying to run the heater at that point is pretty much useless, at least for the next 5 - 7 minutes anyway. They should have enabled a feature whereby a heating element could be engaged - yes, this would decrease battery drive time performance, but it beats freezing. I'm guessing if enough owners complain to Mitsubishi, they'll do an update. Cheers.

 

[Bubka]

Here you can see my driver display for yesterday out of 1 fully charge battery .
I have no complain to have 2.7L/100 km out of 72 driven km on outside temperature -10 C ( -7 C after few minutes seating in garage ).

Each time car started I changed to EV mode.

This 72 km was couple of short city trips started on cold in garage ( 30 km ) and 1 bit longer trip between Cambridge-Kitchener and back (42 km half city / half hwy ).

I see from this point and from experiance from Chevy Volt, I am expecting about 80 - 90km EV only range in summer time and 60-70 km spring/ fall when heat pump not in use on normal driving habbit.

You can see instant difference when you turn off heat your ETA EV range jump by approx. 20%

For example I had this morning while driving with heat set on 21 Celsius ETA EV range 37 km, and than I turned off heat to see difference and it changed instantly from 37 to 44 km ETA

 

[vipmk]

Hi, I'm not sure I follow - I agree and understand the reduction in overall EV driving range when the call for heat in the cabin is initiated. My question relates to how efficient is the actual heating in your PHEV when it's cold outside, specifically after you've driven somewhere on a errand and then come back to the PHEV 10 minutes later, i.e., the PHEV I would have thought, should be able to deliver almost instant heat, but that's not the case with our PHEV (as it takes another 5 - 7 minutes to get any comfortable heat out of the vents. Cheers.

 

[Bubka]

Hi, I'm not sure I follow - I agree and understand the reduction in overall EV driving range when the call for heat in the cabin is initiated. My question relates to how efficient is the actual heating in your PHEV when it's cold outside, specifically after you've driven somewhere on a errand and then come back to the PHEV 10 minutes later, i.e., the PHEV I would have thought, should be able to deliver almost instant heat, but that's not the case with our PHEV (as it takes another 5 - 7 minutes to get any comfortable heat out of the vents. Cheers.

Hi

For me it heat up fast enough

 

[slick]

Thanks for the reply - can you tell me what "really cold" means, i.e., anything below freezing? Unfortunately, their manual is very vague and only references "low temperatures" with no numbers provided. I'm guessing you're thoughts are that you'll be forcing the engine to run and thus make benefit from the radiator - I'll give this a try, but I think the problem is that the "heat pump" is used regardless and it doesn't seem to be efficient at providing early heat, e.g., not until after 5 - 7 minutes of the vehicle running even though it might have only been parked in the grocery store parking lot for 10 minutes. Cheers.

really cold for me would be around -15 or colder . i always leave it on defog and floor these days and battery save after i leave a store or some place . i see no difference than any other car i have ever driven . however - 30 not common here and my old gas car would cool off fast in that never experienced it in this yet .

now keep in mind if you have some form of defog on and drive on normal you the engine will cycle on and off to keep the engine warm during cold temperatures and you will arrive at the store with a warm engine . if you drive at these temps and do it on EV you will arrive with a cold engine .

those element heaters are horribly inefficient better off burning the gas cycling on and off .

 

[AdamJ]

Although I don't drive a PHEV instead a gas outlander, where I live it goes -40 Celsius multiple times a year, this year I had engine errors - limp mode less power engaged and would drive like a slug dumping my fuel economy completely out the window. When the vehicle had warmed up and I restarted the car, the engine notification went away, my phone call to the dealership was responded to that others were experiencing this same issue, and to park it inside a garage or get a block heater going.

So I would have to agree with this thread title, I don't believe this machine was tested extensively in truly cold weather.

 

[ontheroad]

it's not a fun time to deal with the dealer (we had a previous Mitusbishi also).

I'm a fellow Ottawan and am on the verge of ordering/buying a new Outlander PHEV, so I'm curious to know if local Mitsubishi dealers (or Mitsubishi as a company) are problematic to deal with over the long term. This is very important to me since the car must be serviced at a Mitsubishi dealership for the warranty to remain valid. I've never purchased a car from a dealer or had one serviced at a dealership (I take my Corolla to Canadian Tire), so I'm nervous about getting stuck having to deal regularly (say twice per year) with difficult/unethical dealers for the next 5-10 years.

 

[Farklepilot]

Just buy it... I had the first gen Chev Volt. Bought the second gen when it came out. Bought the Chev Bolt (still have it), just traded my Mustang Mach e for the Highlander PHEV GT. To me it is the perfect type of drivetrain. Given my average day driving of 60k, 95% of the time I will be using pure electric drive. When I need to go on a road trip I just feed it gas. Drives really solid in my opinion. Note it will insist you put 15 litres of fuel in it at 90 day interval so five litres a month can be spent pre heating in the cold easily. I believe you are mistaken about having to have servicing done at dealer. So long as you can show vehicle was serviced by an accredited repair facility and they used oil that met the same standards as the oil used at the dealership, use mitsubishi filters, your golden. That said, my dealer charges $99.95 including all oil/filters for the "A" service. $139.95 for the 'B" service and $348 for the "C" service. Guessing if you asked Can Tire what they would charge for those same services it wouldn't be much more at all. Note, you have to have them document they did all the same inspections and servicing as listed in the service booklet. Service requirements are every 8,000k OR five months.

 

[ontheroad]

Just buy it... I had the first gen Chev Volt. Bought the second gen when it came out. Bought the Chev Bolt (still have it), just traded my Mustang Mach e for the Highlander PHEV GT. To me it is the perfect type of drivetrain. Given my average day driving of 60k, 95% of the time I will be using pure electric drive. When I need to go on a road trip I just feed it gas. Drives really solid in my opinion. Note it will insist you put 15 litres of fuel in it at 90 day interval so five litres a month can be spent pre heating in the cold easily. I believe you are mistaken about having to have servicing done at dealer. So long as you can show vehicle was serviced by an accredited repair facility and they used oil that met the same standards as the oil used at the dealership, use mitsubishi filters, your golden. That said, my dealer charges $99.95 including all oil/filters for the "A" service. $139.95 for the 'B" service and $348 for the "C" service. Guessing if you asked Can Tire what they would charge for those same services it wouldn't be much more at all. Note, you have to have them document they did all the same inspections and servicing as listed in the service booklet. Service requirements are every 8,000k OR five months.

Good to know I don't have to get servicing done at the dealer (although I can see Mitsubishi fighting a claim tooth and nail if one didn't follow their guidelines to a T).

What do you mean by "it will insist you put 15 litres of fuel in it at 90 day interval"? Is this just a suggestion to keep the gas from going bad? I'll probably put at least that much in the car regardless, but I'd rather not be forced to do so.

 

[Farklepilot]

As to the not having to service at dealers..... I am NOT an attorney. My statement was based on my 30 years in the automotive industry, not a valid legal opinion! Yep, no choice as to the fuel burn.. the Volt was the same. The reason being they do not want the gas to go "bad'. As mentioned that will probably be a non issue as that's only 5 litres a month. Between occasional use of the power mode, climbing big hills, cold weather pre heat etc shouldn't be an issue. FYI I posted real world electric range results on another post today. Just above zero and I got 70+k range with 85% battery. GREAT vehicle.

 

[Bubka]

Just buy it... I had the first gen Chev Volt. Bought the second gen when it came out. Bought the Chev Bolt (still have it), just traded my Mustang Mach e for the Highlander PHEV GT.

Must be Outlander PHEV.😉
I agree with you about all you said.

 

[Bubka]

What do you mean by "it will insist you put 15 litres of fuel in it at 90 day interval"? Is this just a suggestion to keep the gas from going bad? I'll probably put at least that much in the car regardless, but I'd rather not be forced to do so.

It means you have to put 20 litres of fuel if you run on EV all the time within 3 months and ICE never turned on.
This is only protection because they think fuel quility will decrease if not in use for long time seating in the fuel tank.

 

[SHAKES]

I'm another prospective Canadian buyer of the Outlander PHEV that stumbled onto this thread. I was a bit concerned after reading this so I did some research.

Based on the below video from a Japanese blogger (turn on translated subtitles at around 2:30), their manual states the heat pump works down to -15 C. Likely the closer it gets to that limit, it will take longer to blow hot air.

I noticed in the owner manual it also states "Since heating uses the heat from the engine cooling water, the engine will start when heating is used." I think this echoes what some of the users here said, if they set their drive mode to "Save" and use the defrost functions, perhaps that will cause the engine to kick on and help warm the cabin? The video above also mentions that it won't emit warm air in certain drive modes as well, when the vehicle was used in -24 C weather.